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The Irish political landscape post-Lisbon. All changed, changed utterly? Apparently not… June 22, 2008

Posted by WorldbyStorm in European Union, Irish Politics, Lisbon Treaty.
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I was cycling past Liberty Hall last week and what should I see but a Socialist Party poster advertising a meeting to be held by Joe Higgins suggesting that after the rout of the establishment post-Lisbon it was time to throw the bums out… or words to that effect. While admiring the sentiment I doubted that our overall political structures, bases or institutions would be particularly touched by the vote. Indeed I mentioned as much over on the Irish Left Review. Not because of any special insight on my part but simply due to fighting the good fight across decades and seeing the remarkable ability of liberal capitalist democracy to appropriate pretty much everything that is thrown against it, whether militant or not.

And the results of the latest poll in the Sunday Business Post (which I hope to return to during the week) underscore this and provide a domestic backdrop to Wu Ming’s piece from this weekend.

The government?

the result of the Lisbon referendum seems to have had little impact on the level of satisfaction with the government.

Consider that party support in the wake of the Referendum is as follows, as noted by Pat Leahy in the SBP:

Fianna Fáil retains the support of 40 per cent of the electorate, reflecting no change from last month and demonstrating that the electorate appears to have compartmentalised its attitudes towards the treaty. This is almost the level of support Fianna Fáil secured when winning last year’s general election.

Isn’t this telling? Far from Lisbon reflecting a political earthquake, it is instead effectively a single issue. As Leahy suggests, the attitude to Lisbon was ‘compartmentalised’. And consequently, despite the clear problems for the political classes in this state in terms of credibility, particularly after the ludicrous Ahern machinations, on a broader level public satisfaction or disatisfaction is essentially static. This has some interesting outcomes…

Support for Sinn Féin, the only Dáil party to oppose the treaty, rises marginally to 10 per cent, but shows no big payoff for the party after its Lisbon victory.

That may indeed change as time moves on, but a possible interpretation is that just as the electorate could compartmentalise their attitudes to Lisbon and to the government/parties respectively, SF simply offered a sort of proxy to vocalise discontents. None of which is bad for SF, indeed Mary Lou McDonald must have improved her odds of retaining the European Parliament seat for the party next year substantially, even in a more competitive constituency.

But for others the news is far from good.

However, support for Fine Gael drops sharply, by three points to 25 per cent. This is t h e fourth consecutive monthly decline in support for Enda Kenny’s party and, though the first three drops were each only one point, the party’s standing with voters has now fallen substantially since the start of this year.

This is poor stuff. But hardly a surprise. I argued before that FG appeared in the campaign to be attempting to convey an all things to all voters message rather than being clearly in favour, without equivocation, of the Lisbon Treaty. And add to that the inevitable sense of fatigue at the prospect of another four year stint up to the next General Election and one might imagine that people are testy and keen to do something, anything, to shake things up. And here the problem becomes quite severe for Enda Kenny, because while an affable and decent individual who without question managed by dint of hard work and organisational skills to pull together the FG party prior to 2007, there are problems to his leadership, not least a desperately unschooled outing on Questions and Answers in the week of the vote, which as one Labour party member suggested to me might well lose whole swathes of the Yes side due to an inability to convey a clearly defined message.

And the rest?

There is a slight recovery for the Green Party, which recovers two points since last month and now stands at 7 per cent. The PDs (2 per cent), Labour (10 per cent) and independents (6 per cent) are al l unchanged from lastmonth.

I can’t help but think the Green Party will be happy. Perhaps a case of the issue being explained to the base, or perhaps a sign that they don’t much care either way about it… difficult to know which, but I hope to return to the former thought as well during the week. Labour may have been moving against their support base, but at least they remained essentially consistent throughout. And despite the coverage no great boon for the Independents.

Incidentally, the nonsense we hear today from one of the FG Young Turks about the SF campaign is quite a sight to behold. For, in the Sunday Business Post we read that:

Dublin West TD Leo Varadkar claimed that ‘‘a lot of leftwing campaigns stirred the immigration pot – some deliberately and some unwittingly. He said Sinn Fein used it deliberately.

‘‘If there is anything to be learned about this large working-class vote, it’ s that it’s a right-wing reaction – anti-immigration, protect my job – and not a left-wing vote as Sinn Fein pretends to believe.”

I disagreed with the SF stance during the Referendum, indeed still do on a number of issues, and think that their approach has been one that has sought to massage their vastly more euro-sceptic view of the EU than their literature proposed over the last number of months (indeed a look at their website and the press releases is instructive, not least due to a certain North/South split in terms of language from their MEPs about the EU… check it out). But… that is one thing, Vardkers allegations quite another. It is simply incorrect to say that they pushed any anti-immigration line in that literature or, from what I hear from those who met them, at doorsteps. But then Fine Gael has yet to determine a clear line after the Referendum, for Alan Shatter has said that:

…taking a bi-partisan approach did not do his party any favours.

Oh dear. More of the indecision. This sort of language is only going to feed into a sense that they don’t know where they’re going, and worse, that they’ll trim if it is to their advantage. Not a thought I’d want to slip out into the public arena just now, if I were them.

Comments»

1. FutureTaoiseach - June 22, 2008

The problem is that the only anti-Lisbon party in the Dail is Sinn Fein. I think if we had a credible moderate party opposing it – like maybe Libertas in the future – things could change. But at the same time, history has not been kind to small parties in this country. Our political-culture seems wedded to Civil War politics. Occasionally challengers emerge on the scene but then begin a slow, lingering death. I think immigration might change that eventually though as the newcomers won’t have the same kind of inherited party-preferences we do. In this country voting-patterns tend to run in families.

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2. WorldbyStorm - June 22, 2008

Maybe. I don’t see the space to be honest for a political party built around our relationship with Europe, UKIP in the UK provides evidence that such bodies are simply too limited to strike a note with a general electorate, although in European elections they can do better (that said, I’ll be interested to see if a lot of their vote comes home to the Tories at the next EP elections).

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3. John Palmer - June 22, 2008

Sorry to seem self justifying – but I did more than once question whether any “left” force would be boosted by the “No” success in Ireland. Indeed I said that everywhere – repeat everywhere – in the European Union when the “No” campaigns have succeeded the resulting political impact has strengthened the right – including the hard right. The fact that Fianna Fail have not suffered any reduction in support and that the is some latent support for a neo-Thatcherite outfit like Libertas seems consistent with this analysis. By the way, WorldbyStorm, please make no mistake: UKIP is an formation poised (uneasily) between the hard right of the Tory party and the street fighters of the BNP. The real danger in Britain is that – to counter the risk of support ebbing to UKIP/BNP the Tories will opt for what amounts to a (English) nationalist strategy designed to give the UK a semi-detatched membership of the EU. If that comes to pass and Ireland has not made possible the ratification of the Lisbon Treaty befiore the UK election – the Irish people will have some very nasty choices to make.

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4. Garibaldy - June 22, 2008

Finance capitalism – which the Tories have represented exclusively since Thatcher – needs the EU. Europe is not a great issue among the 10-15% who swing elections. Cameron has learnt that from Hague and Howard’s campaigns. Rhetoric may change, but not reality of full engagement.

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5. Dunne and Crescendo - June 22, 2008

Vardakar wants immigration to be an issue; he raised it himself in the last general election. The subtext from Noel Whelan, John Drennan and the pro-Yes journalists is that the working class would never vote No for progressive reasons, it has to be because they are right-wing racists. If the Shinners can be bashed in the process, even better. According to the Times yesterday immigration was not a substantial factor for No voters. I am a NO voter. I did not hear it raised once, until AFTER the poll.

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6. FutureTaoiseach - June 22, 2008

John Palmer are you the man who was on Q+A the other night from London? I have a bone to pick with you over your claims that we get an elected President of the Commission under Lisbon. You conveniently failed to point out that it would be politicians who elect him, not the general public by universal suffrage. Perhaps you would make that clear in future just so people aren’t confused.

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7. smiffy - June 22, 2008

FutureTaoiseach, we don’t pick bones with other contributors on this site, thank you.

D&C is absolutely to right to take issue with Varadkar – of all people – suggesting that Sinn Féin exploiting the issue of immigration in the referendum campaign. Not only is it untrue – and he hasn’t backed up his assertion with anything like evidence – but he is the one significant political figure who did use the issue in the last general election as a dogwhistle for crackpots out in Dublin West to help push him over the line. Why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother’s eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?

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8. WorldbyStorm - June 22, 2008

Garibaldy, I would tend to John’s view re the UK. It’s very clear that under the Conservatives there would be a further shift. Incidentally, the UK is already well provided with opt-outs, and one need only consider that they’ve refused to enter the euro. That said, no doubts that the EU is a liberal democratic entity, how could it be otherwise? But I’m certain that it opens possibilities to us on the left.

D&C is right, the immigration issue is being used by V.

FT, we’re trying to discuss these things in as calm a manner as is possible. Please bear that in mind. By all means parse out things, but let’s keep it civil.

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9. John Palmer - June 22, 2008

FutureTaoiseach – on the point about electing the Commisison President – I am not wrong. For the first time the European Council has undertaken to propose the candidate for the Presidency of the Commission which reflects the results of the direct elections to the European Parliament. That means the way is now open (if the treaty is ratified) for the political parties to nominate their candidates as part of their election campaign. So voters supporting the Greens, or the Liberals, or the Social Democrats or whoever will know who the party is proposing for President. Of course the largest party will then have to negotiate with some others to secure a European Parliament majority (unless one party has an overall majority). This is potentially a very important move forward because (also under the treaty) the President elect of the Commisison will have greater power to select his or her team from the list of candidates put forward by each Member State. Ineed states would have to offer a range of candidates for the President Elect to choose from. Of course if the Lisbon Treaty has top be abandoned because of the Irish veto – we will be back to the usual horse trading ion smoke filled rooms for a new President to emerge.

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10. Garibaldy - June 22, 2008

WBS,

The text of the post says Irish Left Archive, not Irish Left Review, if you want to change it. On the Tories, I’m not at all sure. I mean, where is there to go, and how many votes are there in it really? As for my point about finance capital, no amount of left pushing of the EU – and I agree that it could potentially push through progressive legislation as it has done in the past, though I think the most of that potential has been reached – will remove the free movement of capital and labour, and facilitation of international speculation, that the City thrives on.

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11. WorldbyStorm - June 23, 2008

Garibaldy, oops, cheers for that. Archive on the brain…

I’m not sure why you think the EUs potential has been reached. I’d have thought that in a global sense it is the one institution that is most clearly amenable to the centre left, further left influence, much much more so than the post WW2 institutions. It’s smaller, the number of left of centre/centre left governments involved is proportionately larger. It’s not federal, but arguably the populations it encompasses are more on the progressive than otherwise side of the fence, with strong strong left social democratic instincts. Of course it’s not going to be a democratic socialist hegemon, and it’s always open, as we’ve seen to the opposite dynamic from well organised elements of the centre/centre right. But looking back at the UK, it’s precisely the issue you point to, the primacy of the City in the UK context that is one of the reasons the UK is keen to remain somewhat detached (not least I suspect for the optics – sterling replaced by the euro has to lead to some diminuition of the sui generis status of the City). But even were I wrong about the possibilities for future progress, at the very least the centre/further left has to be in there fighting to maintain an EU which has brought a broadly social democratic international tinge to relations on the continent. Not least because these have very real impacts to improve the lives of working people across that continent, and in particular on this island. And beyond that there is the opportunity to restrain adventurism by Europe as a whole and to provide a non federalist, more social democratic alternative to either the emerging powers or the US.

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12. Where is Fine Gael’s David Cameron? | Richard Delevan - June 27, 2008

[…] saliently, if you’re wondering why the Lisbon debacle and the economic malaise gripping the country have not – yet – made a dent in […]

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13. The Irish political landscape post-Lisbon. All changed, changed utterly? Apparently not?: Bits of art - June 28, 2008

[…] Link: Irish Blogs […]

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14. Seamus Breathnach - June 30, 2008

Seamus Breathnach // June 29, 2008 at 2:31 p.m.

The Papacy,
Lisbon and The Irish Vote

Today Saturday 28 June, 2008, in the centre of O’Connell Street , Dublin, there was great rejoicing coming from a shop that was obviously religious. The shop (broadcasting hymns and exhibiting chalk statutes etc.) exhibited a large poster in the front window to demonstrate that a Novena offered up by the Church to enlighten the people of Ireland to vote ‘No’ to the Lisbon Treaty had been answered. What has been most suspect in the recent Lisbon election is the hidden number of the Novena-faithful. What is confusing is how so many of the faithful could vote ‘No’ to the Lisbon Treaty so definitely, while their leader, Pope Benedict XVI, could be so circumspectly in favour of a United Europe. It might be remembered that the Pope’s guarded idea of unity comes ‘after’ rather than before the Irish vote! How can such ambivalence and apparent contradiction be explained?

Perhaps some relevant facts about THE IRISH might not be out of place :

1. Since the Middle Ages a Papal colony calling themselves Catholics and forming ‘a middle nation’ (i.e. Between native pagans and ‘real’ Norman English) took over Ireland. These colonists , in contrast to the repressed Gaels, consttute the modern ‘Irish’, and on behalf of the Papacy have governed Ireland vi pulsa and ‘by the grace of God’ (of the Caesarean variety) ever since.

2. Through the Papacy the diocesan Bishops and Parish Priests sperad their control over the island and dislodged the secular native pagan Chieftains. These dioceses and parishes have always formed the most conservative and at times reactionary collective mind in Europe; for it is a mind that has been totally indebted to the Papacy for its very existence and has , in return, submitted to becoming the most perfect instrument of imperial Christian propaganda world-wide.

3. Accordingly, in the Lisbon Vote, we witness the Irish (middle nation) turning its collective back — or ‘apparently’ turning its back — on its own leaders, and notwithstanding net receipts of some 32b euros, without which the Irish would still be swinging out of a Castle-cum-Cathedral culture, the pack voted a resounding ‘No’ to Europe. Much of this bonus money went wisely towards the creation of an Irish middle class, hitherto practically non-existent except for that tight parochial swathe of people that lived primarily off Church/State construction and allied services. In the absence of an Irish middle class, secular resistance to the rule of the Parish Priest is unknown in Ireland, and even if the Euro has helped enormously in this direction, as a class, it is still, perhaps, the last and certainly (barring Northern Ireland) the least and the pettiest bourgeois formation in Western Europe. Nevertheless, the Irish , for the second time , took Europe’s money on the pretext of having a shared affection and appreciation for it , but once the money was spent, like women of an unflattering variety, they Irish ran to the protection of their more enduring master. What tune were they listening to — such that they could ‘apparently’ divorce themselves from their entire secular leadership? One might recall how , after the Nice Referendum , the Department of the Taoiseach, made the following statement:

‘I warmly welcome this extremely important decision of the Irish people. We can now ratify the Treaty of Nice and the truly historic enlargement of the European Union can go ahead. The Irish peoples decision was made following extensive debate — a deeper debate than any we have had since our initial decision to join the EEC. 

Perhaps the Irish will always need a second bite of the cherry to really savour it. In the meantime ,however, the strength of of those opposed to the Treaty would have us believe that the Irish will is implacably written in Tablets as enduring as the Ten Commandments.

4. Sinn Fein/IRA , lately come from the very limited and horrifically reactionary streets of Catholic Belfast, is the first of such voices to sing ‘No’ to Lisbon, and is, ironically, the only elected voice among the promoters of a ‘No’ vote. For those who do not understand Sinn Fein/IRA , it would be fair to say that, despite their oft-quoted guff about ‘Marx’, dating from the time when they were underdogs fighting the RIC from the strongholds of Belfast, they really enjoy the same relation with the Church/State as , perhaps, the Franco regime did back in the ‘30s, their only claim to an ‘educated’ or an informed political consciousness being dependent upon the Catholic priests who have shunted them from the barricades to the benches of Parliament. People should not be too surprised at this: it has long become part of the universal church’s appeal to allow its faithful, especially in South America and Cuba, to give voice to their appalling social conditions, knowing full well that by the time they come to power they shall be ‘defined in’ to the system with minimum persuasion — just as Sinn Fein are being co-opted in just as we speak. That they were ever ‘outside’ the capitalist system in any real Marxist sense is a debate for another day. Indeed, there are some who believe that their real grievance, though dressed up in the rhetoric of Liberation Theology is not about the ‘working classs truggle’ — and was never about anything more than a neurosis for more ‘Catholic Emancipation’. Nevertheless, however anxious Sinn Fein/IRA is to distinguish their party in the Republic of Ireland, they would on their own make preciious little of a persuasive difference. Moreover, the erstwhile ‘Marxist’ party had little hope of making allies with others.

So, with whom were they allied? The only real ally Sinn Fein/IRA ever had in Ireland was the Church. But rather peculiarly, they joined with a total outsider — a chap called Declan Ganley, (whom no one had ever heard of before Lisbon.) Ganley is an impressive performer, who keeps the identity of his backers under an Opus Dei-like seal. For all the world he has a stride not dissimilar to that of Oswald Mosley, and when he revealed himself as the declared leader of a groupless-group interestingly called ‘Libertas’, he was quick to disarm the little Irish curiousity there was by assuring one and all that he was a ‘good Catholic’ he is. Whereever Mr Ganley is from originally, or whatever interests he represents, one can be fairly sure that he does not habitually speak the Gaelic language that Gerry Adams is so keen to have Northern Protestants speak, or , for that matter, that he ever played hurling for Oughterard. On the face of it, however, this was the man with whom Sinn Fein appeared to hatch the plot of the ‘No’ vote — a plot that emanated from the most opaque if conservative location in the mysterious Catholic spectrum.

5. Again one got whiffs of the Franco regime when each debate started. ‘One’s children had to be protected’, was the spiel; ‘democracy (sorry ‘greater democracy’) was at stake’, and Europe’s democracy had to be protected by the ever so democratic Irish. Having spent monies in large quantities, Declan Ganley (the ‘Business-man’ -cum- ‘Good Catholic’) garnered the ‘No’ vote at a time when, by any standards, the government canvassed as if they couldn’t care less — an attitude that was picked up by most journalists, including Bruce Arnold of the Irish Independent, who rightly excoriated them on this very point. The point is: the government were so lacklustre in their business that one went so far as to wonder why they were so ill-organised.

Ostensibly , then, the ‘No’ campaign concerned itself with negative fears, while the Government did very little that was either meaningful, impressive or, indeed, had the ring of authenticity about it.

So, what, one might ask , were all these fears?

There was the amplified fear of Ireland being dragged into war on Europe’s behalf, even though the US, flying out of Galway, had been engaged in an illegal war for years — a fact which people , including the ‘No’ voters, temporarily forgot. Then there was the sexual promiscuity – fear , even though no one dared mention ‘clerical pedophilia’ as a suitable object of European reform. As all Irish people know only too well, the damages arising from clerical pedophelia are paid almost exslusively by the Irish taxpayer — hardlhy a cause for rejoicing even in the most hallowed circles!. But this also was never mentioned due to a temporary loss of memory. On the part of the ‘No’ campaigners. And there was also a set of assorted ragtag sources of distemper, some legitimate, like the fishermen’s griveance and , to a lesser extent, the farmers.

6. Behind all this was an ongoing daily saga for months and years respecting the utter squalor of Irish public life. The squalor was shared incestuously and jointly by the RCC and its aweful hand-maiden, the so-called secular Republic. This debilitating squalor-fest remained in fateful counterpoint with the paralysed anger of the Irish people for years. The managerial effrontery of their leaders. Religous and secular, was suffocating. Even as Archbishop Diarmuid Martin, Pope Benedict XVI’s new Dublin broom, was preaching a hand-in-glove crusade with Premier Bertie Ahern against Irish crime, the whole Church/State ensemble collapsed into a cadence which saw Premier Bertie Ahern ignominiously leave office and, of course, with the people voting a decisive ‘No’, not just to Lisbon, but to the incredible squalor that had plagued the Irish Chruch/State since the days of C.J. Haughey, Dermot Morgan’s church ridicule ‘Father Ted’ and the Church/State coverup of significant clerical pedophelia. The vote was an angry vote, a vote to redeem the democratic process, not just from Lisbon, but much more significantly from the mediaevalism and mediocrity of the Irish State, over which they , the people , had no control whatsoever. One might be forgiven for thinking that it was a ‘curse-on-both-your-houses’ kind of vote, a curse on the Irish Church/State ensemble and a curse on its connection with the Lisbon Treaty.

Nevertheless, it is hardly conceiveable that Sinn Fein/IRA, on their own, or coupled with the ‘dark horse’ Declan Ganley — from whom they are not as ideologically dissimilar as their representations would lead one to believe — could have delivered the ‘No’ vote. Something else was needed. And that something else was Opus Dei, that body of good and pious souls who shunt incessantly between Premier’s Office and Archbishop’s tent. These men (and women), a lot of them, adept at table mannners on the Brussels-gravy train, and living high off the civil service hog of the ‘Yes-Minister’ variety, are never to be underestimated; they are, in effect, experts at calculating ‘who’ should the Church/State needs most to be in office as well as ‘who’ shall remain in office. Such matters are their raison d’etre. They knew what was possible , what was achieveable and what was desirable. They also knew how to achieve it.

After all, Opus Dei has kept power in church-laden hands ever since 1922, the only conceiveable ripple in their seamless success being the enigma as to how in the 1930s De Valera managed to dislodge Cumann Na nGaedhael after a decade of faithful Church-service. Some will tell you that it was the 1937 Constitution and the Special Position given by Dev to the Catholic church, or alternatively, perhaps it was due to the special position given by the Pope to Dev in return for drafting the Constitution in accord with Papal principles. Others , of course, will mention the Eucharistic Congress and how the State put the Church’s needs first, a bit like the O’Briens of medieval Munster giving the only decent castle they had in Cashel to the Pope’s legate, when they themselves slept on the mountain side ; others still will recall the new Constitution’s ban on secular divorce and the Vatican’s concern to gear Irish fertility towards the American missionary market ; others will recall the gradual monopoly of the hospitals and the schools secured under Fianna Fail hegemony, while others still will reflect upon the censorship laws and a raft of repressive Catholic legislation that kept writers in the doghouse and the religious in powerful positions extending to every nook and cranny of the so-called Republic. Indeed, the Church also needed someone they could trust to ratline the Nazis, someone who would keep that aspect of Irish neutrality secret.

For our present purposes , it really doesn’t matter; what matters is that everyone in the Republic of Ireland knows as a matter of fact and lifestyle, that all elections are won by the Church of Rome and its legion of ‘good Catholics’. Indeed, whoever fights the ‘secular’ elections, the Angelus will still be broadcat nationally from the nation’s ecumenical, multicultural radio and television station, RTE. So, if Frianna Fail didn’t cowtow to the Roman Church, there are always other brethern among the rank and file of all the other parties to perform the same or a similar sergice. Indeed, Opus Dei has them championing at the bit to emulate Fianna Fail in serving the Church and, in consequence, manage Ireland soley towards that covetted if inglorious end.

7. The relevant question here is not so much WHETHER Opus Dei tapped into all the Church’s liege parties that were ‘ostensibly’ for the Lisbon treaty, but in respect of which all their followers found just cause to abandon them entirely — but rather ‘HOW’ did Opus Dei do it without sending out a religious alarm. The answer to this question lies in the most peculiar allignment between the Catholic Church, its episcopacy and the leaders of all the political parties. It is as if they were knowingly caught in a bind and the best way , not to be outflanked by the super-catholic Sinn Fein/IRA for permanent Church favour, what panned out was the best compromise for all concerned.

8. Regarding this ambivalence of the political party leaders, practically every commentator will tell you frankly that the government ran a shambles of a campaign. (The press is also part of the religious culture that obtains throughout the warp and weft of Irish life. They , too , indulge in theatre, by prying, but not prying deeply or relentless enough. In this respect, if it had not been for members of the British media, Catholic pedophelia in Ireland would never have been revealed!) The parties openly went through the theatre of criticizing each other for not being in earnest about returning a ‘Yes’ vote. Notoriously, some of them even broadcast the fact that they had not read the Treaty. Put it all together and you get Holy Roman Irish theatre – and on reflection, it all weighs in the balance. The Government and the ‘opposition’ parties threw the election to allow the Vatican to pronounce its veto on the European Community. Barusso probably was the safeguard to allow the theatre to have full effect and, at the same time, secure a second bite at the cherry for the Catholic Irish.

9. What all these things taken individually point to is a rather impoverished cultural and intellectual society, a society not at all informed in the proper areas and sadly if curiously lacking in the hard questions when it comes to the nub of secular politics. Who, for example, is Declan Ganley? What are his American interests? Why should being a ‘good Catholic’ require mention if not to cover a trail that might open up greater questions? And why spend over a million Euros on saying ‘No’?

10. Taken together, however, they offer us the true contours of a much more sinister reason for the ‘No’ to Lisbon vote. After the election the triumph of the most reactionary religious and conservative cabals in Britain and throughout the Roman Catholic world is not insignificant. Neither is it insignificant with what lack of conviction all the Irish parties portrayed their alleged desire for a ‘Yes’ vote. On reflection, it can well be argued that the whole Irish campaign was a Holy Roman stratagem, designed to allow the government to appear to be secular and in favour of secular Europe, but which in effect had compromised the election, prefering to obey its Roman masters while relying upon the secular authorities in Europe to reward them further. What the Irish really want, is what the Pope — now victorious on his own terms — is quick to tell us; the Pope now wants a unified Europe, but one unified in Christianity. We are back with Charlemagne and the vicious Papal plots against the secular powers of Europe — where Islam and the Turks are demonised and he crowns Europe as the home of Christianity. Of course the Irish want what the Pope of the day wants; to think otherwise would be outside the ken of either Irish or Polish realpolitik. Which brings us to the Pope’s eulogy for the Irish in Europe, as the softener for having controlled the Irish vote through Opus Dei , the Jesuits and the Redemptorists.

The Pope needed a ‘No’ vote in order to tell Europe that Catholic Europe is still in contention and that he is the head — the pro-active and conspiratorial head of that Church. Coupled with the Poles’ fervently praying for a ‘No Vote’ and congratulating the Irish, the Novena in O’Connell Street echoes the truth of what had happened. The Irish government, ever ready to do theatre, did what the Pope and Opus Dei wanted. There was nothing senseless about the Irish vote, no more than there was anything senseless about the notice asserting the triumph of the Novena in O’Connell Street.

11. In his speech concerning Ireland’s contribution to spreading the Roman message (the Irish love such assurances), the Pope unfortunately omits some salient facts. He doesn’t mention, for example, that the triumph of the “Irish’ (for which read the Anglici Norman colony in Ireland) Church occasioned the burning to death of native Gaelic Chieftains for saying that there never was a Jesus — for saying no more, in effect, than what modern-day scholars of the calibre of Francesco Carotta (War Jesus Caesar?) or Joseph Atwill (Caesar’s Messiah) are saying. Secondly, it is in this context that Ireland’s so-called Golden Age of Christianity consisted no more than of really trying to re-sell to Europe that which Europe had already in its wisdom discarded (Christianity). And thirdly, if the Irish played such a Christian role in Europe as the Pope conveniently imagines, or if they had been so ‘Saintly and Scholarly’ rather than an unquestioning colony of liege lackeys of the Papacy, why did Benedict XVI’s predecessors draft Laudabiliter,a Papal Bull that delivered Gaelic Ireland bound hand-and-foot to Henry the 11 to Christianize?

12. Finally, what the Lisbon ‘No’ Vote demonstrates is that Ireland is as impressionable as it is manipulable by the RC Church. Over the decades and centuries it has developed little by way of distinct colonial cultural roots conducive of an enduring or intellectual environment, or , indeed, an environment independent of the Vaticanal or Jesuitical control. Perhaps, after 1,500 years of uninterrupted and unquestioned priestcraft, one should not expect too much from a significantly insecure community and one that is totally lacking in secular and political innovation.

Some people joined Europe — not so much to reform it — but to be reformed by it. I am one of these!But if this cannot be achieved, then Europe might well conceive of moving ahead without a Papal veto on every secular step taken to improve communal life. As James Joyce, Dave Allen, Dermot Morgan and thousands of ordinary Irish people have demonstrated in the past, confronted with such religious intransigence moving out of Catholic Ireland is not always an undesirable option.

Seamus Breathnach

http://www.irish-criminology.com

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15. ejh - June 30, 2008

Where do we sign?

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16. Hugh Green - June 30, 2008

Seamus Breathnach’s thesis is missing one vital component: an auto-flagellating albino monk.

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17. WorldbyStorm - June 30, 2008

🙂

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18. Seamus Breathnach - July 4, 2008

There are auto-flagellating monks, albino and other, all over Dublin, Cork, Limerick and Waterford. If Hugh Green waits about RTE when the Angelus gong goes off, he will find them flocking to the station like Pavlovian dogs salivating for a meek-and-mild flogging! Failing that ,he should visit, the Bar Libarary, UCD, Leinster House and/or RTE itself.

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19. cactus flower - October 19, 2008

Just read Seamus Breathnach’s tour de force. There is much in it, Seamus, that is interesting to me and its convincing in the look taken at the Catholic right. The only flaw is that it ignores the evidence on who voted no – overwhelmingly a working class vote. There was a fairly straightforward rich-poor divide.
I fully concurr on the Francoite whiff from Declan Ganley, which has been well thrashed out and not at all ignored as you suggest. Did you read Ganley’s lengthy interview in the Hibernian?

I am reminded somehow here of our old friend Joel from P.ie whose only virtue is that he reminds us how internalised racist attitudes become – Seamus’s piece at the end of the day is redolent of the tone of the 19th Punch Magazine.

The characterisation you make is to winkle out the most reactionary tendencies in the Republican movement and in the very diverse groups who campaigned against Lisbon, and to tar the whole thing with the one brush. Imv it is when taken as whole a total distortion of reality.

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20. Seamus Breathnach - October 21, 2008

To talk at all about a ‘Catholic right’ presupposes that there is a ‘left’ of some description in Ireland. Such self-flattery is, to my mind, as illusory as the mediteranean myth. Where, for example, in Hegelian terms was there ever an ‘Irish left’? To my mind, the term has been always used in a general manner that excused any further lack of analysis and meant no more than ascribing to one person or group a perceptible level of unwanted liberality. Even Bertie Ahern saw himself as a ‘socialist.’

Only in Ireland can such a disconnection between words and concepts obtain… The reason there is no ‘left wing’ in Ireland is because we are so Catholic. If that sounds banal, then it is purely because it is a truism. When the struggle obtains between the clerical certainty of a theology and and the secular nature of philosophy (as with the Englightement and the Reformation) — as it is preeminently the continuing case in Ireland — the only thing possible is a marginal move to have secular society accomodated temporarily and marginally. And since Irish society is so far from being secular (whether it knows it or not) , its first developmental necessity is to beat back the bishops in order to make a space for the new plant to grow.

Irish ‘universities’ have never made secular philosophy welcome! The cead mile failte was a pagan notion and we know how welcome they are in third-level education. Irish universities, as with every single Irish institution since the preface to the Senchas Mar was written, is circumscribed by the stifling ignorance of the Catholic myth.

This circumscription did not begin with the cruelest and most hateful campaign by the Catholic Church on Irish or Vietnamese Communists, but had rather begun with the initial crusades of hatred as part of the mediaeval church reforms. The evidence for this early crusades of hatred is perfectlly evident to any Irish person who ventures out of Dublin. It won’t be long before he or she is confronted by a Castle-and-a-Cathedral, both edifices the product of the Papal/Norman conquest. Under the shadow of these depressing buildings all Irish life remains , and it will appear on reflection that ‘Irish’ life has not moved a whit since, and whatever movement it made before they were built has been utterly destroyed centuries ago, including the language that housed those pagan aborigines. Moreover, it will also be apparent that where the Castle has fallen into ruin, the Cathedral has prospered.

So, what’s the moral?

The castle-cum-cathedral culture of the Roman clergy has kept the secular people of Ireland in an incubator more tight than phosporus in water. And if there is movement towards the creation of wealth in the twentieth century , it only comes about within this context. To make a long story a litle shorter: coming out of medieval Catholicism, the most that one can see is really the freedoms of mercantilism. No further progress is possible, and to use words that are indicative of some kind of understanding with one’s environment is devoutly to be wished, even if such words, like ‘left’, ‘socialism’, ‘freedom’, etc. , are totally divorced from any conceptual framework reflective of Irish development.

The best metaphor for apprehending this difficulty must surely be the ‘Irish’ soccer team. Where , hardly a handful of native players (managed superbly and profitably by Jackie Charleton) come from the native league, a splash of paint suffices to satisfy Ireland’s ambitions to be a player on the European soccer stage. So convincing is this ‘trick’ of perception that you can actually hear some Irish commentators and public alike, demanding that they beat teams like Italy, Germany, Holland and Britain. The identity is complete – Irishness is not that far removed either from paint of chalk. If you listen carefully, however, to the unrestrained bravado flowing from the ‘Italian goal’ alone, one knows that the expectations are also tinged with much greater misgivings than the shouts would ever betray.

The words nowhere realistically meet the conceptual framework or the structural division of labour necessary to make them real. If the Irish have hardly a few home teams playing soccer, and coming from an anti-soccer history within a small population, any realistic person must wonder that we should field a team at all. That we are serious contenders in our own right, is ridiculous. Similarly, that we can transcend the very narrow Catholic values we have accepted for so long, and , in particular, the necessary gapped structure by which the ‘flock’ follow and the ‘clerics’ as an ‘intellectual’ class lead, without a thorough-going war, is ridiculous.

Ask Bertie Ahern: being Irish is being Catholic… If it should be otherwise, then , as I have already said , the first movement must be towards appreciating ‘secular values’. But secular values can only be appreciated when they win space for themselves in a most callous and hostile environment — for creativity cannot come out of a society drowned in medieval mythologies.

I listened to the radio the other day , and a young man had said something about the ‘Blessed Virgin.’ Instantly , there was a complaint from an old woman, and while he had said nothing direspectful, the old woman insisted that he had put the existence of the Blessed Virgin in doubt. Whether he did or not is arguable — but the result of this old woman’s complaint meant that pressure was now put on the young man to state categorically that the Blessed Virgin was unquestionably the holy mother of God.

One felt like sending one and all some historical documents on the point. My point is that that is what it is like with a totalitarian brand of Catholicism — and so far as I am aware all brands are totalitarian, but that some cultures have managed to hold their cultural and inellectual fidelity to the fearless pursuit of truth and not allow dogmatic religion such sway over personal or national development. The upshot is that yet again it has gone out from the national airways that the Blessed Virgin is the pro-active Mother of God — and all modern biblical scholarship might as well not have been written. Everywhere Faith, Blind Faith,dominates truth and science.

In a similar vein, Mr Ganley is not called upon to make a full account of himself beyond the holding excuse that he is a ‘Catholic’. One would like to know if he played hurling for Oughterard at any time, or what Catholic college or CBS school he grew up in — or if , indeed, he met either Jimmy Doyle or Cardinal Brady on a GAA field. The Irish, so curious in other respects, don’t seem to know what his father did, where his mother was from, what initial influences surrounded his childhood and teens in Ireland and what thereafrer moulded his character. A man who, in league with the back-street boys of Belfast, about which we know everything, was able to tap into that great gap that lies between the ‘sheep’ and their pastor, the governed and the governing, and drive Irish people clearly away from their own leaders.

Isn’t this the predicament which has been carefully moulded by the confessional Catholic state? Where, between the government (the priest/politiican) and the flock (the penitents/citizens) , no social mobility is possible on the religious side, no alternative to religious certainties are sought , so no compromises can be reached. As everyone knows all Irish security can be thoroughly penetrated with a toothpick and a crucifix. There is nothing sacred in Irish life moreso than obedience to the priest and the values he makes sure no one can argue beyond or take issue with. Reason itself is absolutely sterile unless it is consciously in tandem with the values which underwrite it. And it is this unquestioned situation which makes it perflectly proper to say that whoever runs for elective power, it is a foregone conclusion that the RCC will win: for whatever the pros and cons, the values will coral whoever wins in the church’s normative fold.

Being Irish is being unwittingly thus. It is only people like Joyce and the late Dermot Morgan who dare to challenge. Maybe scores of others feel he same, maybe some politicians feel that way, but whatever they feel, they first feel that they cannot say but what is expected of them before an eagle-eyed church. Being able to make people conform is virtue enough for the tyrant church; it is under such conditions that the Irish live and have lived since the pagan suppression of the fourteenth century.

If one still does not see under what severe limitations the Irish citizen labours, might one remind him of the fact and the manner in which his Republic was declared, of the payment of over 1bn. in damages to clerical pedophiles, and of the Government’s recent guarantee to the banks.
All these decisions were either done by one or two people or in any event on a very low discussion-base. In the last instance, it is surely noticeable — despite the obvious contrast between the guarantee and the over-seventy-medical cards — how summarily the decision was taken, without either consultation howsoever with people how might represent all other Irish people outside the banking sector or without analysis of the church’s and the GAA’s interests in such a decision. Needless to say, where other countries, even the US, have interfered the interests of the taxpayer was discussed and was protected; they Irish government (that is , Church-and-State) unilaterally decided to go the full hog without asking for a cent in return. Appointments on the Banks BOARDS is really only jobs for the boys and the payments to be paid? Piffle!

So, the Church was looked after in the pedophile cases, the Banks are looked after (even though AIB had already been found cooking the books to overcharge the public), and now it is time for the Doctors, the Lawyers, and through education, the Church again, and through charities, the Chruch again, and through looking after the prisoner, the poor, the emigrant, the Church needs to milk more moneys… the notion of a secular social science is not within our collective (or should one say, ‘selective’) ken.

God bless us all, everyone!

Seamus Breathnach

http://www.irish-criminology.com

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21. WorldbyStorm - October 21, 2008

Hmmmm I was in college in one national institution, neither UCD or TCD, and later went did a post-grad in UCD. Can’t say I saw any particular Catholicism in either place. And working in 3rd level as I do myself I still don’t. The idea of the universities as ‘Catholic’ in any meaningful fashion in the 2000s seems a bit of a stretch.

Re a Catholic left, actually there was a vibrant Catholic left influenced by Vatican II and later liberation theology. We still see some elements of that in CORI. Now I’m not hugely partial to ‘religion’ (of whatever stripe) linked to leftism, for various reasons, but I have no reason to doubt the sincerity of men and women from the clergy who were by any sensible defintion left/liberal in their views. That these groups were small is true, but so is the Irish left more broadly. And while I think there’s something in your argument about aspects of Catholicism stifling the left, how come Portugal, Spain or indeed Italy to name three profoundly Catholic countries didn’t see the same dynamic?

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22. sonofstan - October 21, 2008

No sure WBS – one particular dept. in UCD, philosophy, had, until last year as its head, Ger Casey, a man very much of the catholic right and two other staff members generally held to be Opus members. One of these has been shunted off to run a research project on Newman; and there are still quite a few post- grads working on obscure areas of theo- philosophy. Its still not by any means an entirely congenial place for a leftist (and while its ancient history now, the hounding out of Philip Pettit in the early 70s shouldn’t be forgotten).

And on your last point ‘how come Portugal, Spain or indeed Italy’ didnt see Catholicism stifling the left?! – the first two, in living memory had Fascist dictatorships identified with and -largely- supported by the church- and which stifled the left pretty comprehensively – and while Mussolini might not quite be in living memory anymore……….. while you see what I’m getting at. Granted, all three countries have stronger ‘lefts’ than Ireland, possibly to an extent due to that very repression.

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23. WorldbyStorm - October 21, 2008

Ger Casey wasn’t employed due to his religious beliefs and had every right to be a member of the Catholic right, or indeed a member of Opus Dei in his personal life. What he would not have the right to do is proselytize on behalf of the Catholic faith. And the number of leftists I know personally within the UCD staff entirely outweighs the number of right wing Catholic staff members – much as I would expect. The idea that UCD is a bastion of Catholicism is simply untenable.

Sure, re Portugal and Spain, but.. the point is that there is no clear diagrammatic reason why Catholicism should prevent leftism from developing and/or flourishing. And if the situation was so appallingly bad here then why didn’t it operate in much the same way, i.e. it undermined the Catholic right once the scandals et al came to light? Could it be that there isn’t a specific linkage between religion and the development or not of the left? Or as a generation of leftists will attest, chances are in Ireland it was a combination of small industrial base in south, largely agrarian economy, rapid move to cities, precedence of national over class struggle, etc, etc. And yes, the Church played its part, but it was only one amongst many.

It’s not that there was no repressiveness here, quite the opposite, but I don’t think it functioned in quite the way some people think.

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24. sonofstan - October 21, 2008

Ger Casey wasn’t employed due to his religious beliefs and had every right to be a member of the Catholic right, or indeed a member of Opus Dei in his personal life. What he would not have the right to do is proselytize on behalf of the Catholic faith.

Well, yes and no.
Of course he has every right to his beliefs, and no, he doesn’t proselytise (much). Thing is, he joined the dept. at a time when it was still largely staffed and run by clerics and when it was quite explicitly thought of itself as a ‘Catholic’ philosophy dept. and thus, it might be argued, he may owe his career to the congruence between his views (and research interests) and those of his then superiors. And of course a philosophy lecturer has as much right to be a member of OD as a sociology lecturer has to belong to the SWP – but the suspicion that certain areas of research might be supported and certain other areas, let us say, not so supported, thanks to the influence of key members of the dept. can be invidious. And I wasn’t suggesting that UCD was a bastion of Caholicism – I was suggesting that a one dept. once was (well within the span of an academic career), and that the influence lingers a little bit more than you might expect. Nothing more.
Remember you said ‘I can’t say I saw any particular catholicism in either place’ – I was answering that with a particular example…..

Could it be that there isn’t a specific linkage between religion and the development or not of the left?

I probably agree with this – of the factors you go on to list though, all are common to Spain and Portugal (and Italy) as well as Ireland exceptthe precedence of the national over the class struggle.

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25. Seamus Breathnach - October 21, 2008

WorldbyStorm, still anonymous, is so prepared to defend the proposition that ‘our’ universities are not run by the religious when everyone knows they are. Even in the technological colleges, mostly manned by Opus Dei lick-spittles and guaranteed to be so by Mr. Michael Woods, who had no problem pushing through legislation which not only got the endless pedophilic crimes of the Holy Romans out of sight of the Irish people, but managed to dump the bill on the citizens of this awfully Catholic country.

And when those of us who are fighting actually to try and make a secular space in the same society that Joyce fled, we get the argument that there is a ‘left-wing faction’ operative — Where? Inside the Catholic Church. Such self-delusion is impossible to find anywhere in the world, even in East Timor.

I think it imperative that people who pretend strong passions or political convictions, show their faces and drop the Opus Dei cover. We are, after all, a Republic governed by the absolute right,so why, when arguing for the further right — why not give your name.

Anyone who has listened to Ger Casey (or Patricia) knows precisely where the Caseys stand. The real search is for someone who has somethinng to say that has not been biblically forged out of the middle ages.Not too long ago, all the sociology departments were manned by Jesuits calling themselves Sociologists…. Where else in the world would you get such mediocrity except in places llike Rwanda. Where else could you find a ‘modern State’ where the crystal ball of christianity prevents any social science from surfacing? Where else are all the weak sides of the economy, the poor, the weak, the old, the educational system — all the things that the secular social scientists should be manning and progressively criticising — where else are all these activities hived off by the Church, which uses them constantly to milk further funds from the State? Where else ratline Nazies and the populace haven’t a clue about it and lack any indignation after? Where ele — who else would pay to have their children buggered by clerics? Where else in the world does one get a national tv station that cannot stop pushing Christian imperialism? Where else do you find so many beggars on the streets — all of them , well-got males and females, for charities that are not even registered and never analysed?

The quality of the argument on this page, by the anonymous ones, is developing into that patronising nonsense that people imagine is ‘Irish charm’. At any moment now we will get ‘Jesus said….” or ‘The Bible says..’.. Given the mediaeval goodies that ‘we’ have to offer, is it any wonder that Irish youth is so ready to top itself.

Consider this, as people fight for their medical cards.

The entire Irish government, its entire legal, parliamentary and governmental, machinary was mustered by our ‘Taoiseach’, Brien Cowan, in order to pay MR MICHAEL WOODS a pensionable extra sum in the amount of 75,000 euros… Imagine that! Wouldn’t that make you want to kill yourself!

Seamus Breathnach

www. irish-criminology.com

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26. WorldbyStorm - October 21, 2008

Seamus, ‘everyone knows that they are’? Really? I strongly doubt that. Or if that’s what they think then they have little understanding of the funding, administration and staffing of our universities. And the ITs? Funded by Opus Dei ‘lick-spittles’. I’m no fan of Opus Dei either, quite the opposite, but as it happens I’ve been an extern examiner at two ITs and I can tell you that again anyone who thinks that that ethos infuses them in any significant way is way off line.

As for the rest, you are absolutely entitled to your opinions and it’s great you have a site to promote them. If you took five minutes to read this site you’d see that it has been harshly critical of Catholic social policy and the cheerleaders of same in the media. But measured in that criticism. Measured.

If you serious think that the argument will devolve to one based in Biblical contexts then I think that says more about your thoughts and expectations than mine.

Finally, I use a handle much like many other people on the internet, and I note most who visit here, for my own reasons and I see no compelling argument to discard it for your reasons. Particularly in light of comments that I know from personal experience to be at best overblown.

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27. WorldbyStorm - October 21, 2008

sonofstan, again I don’t dispute Casey may well have come through at a certain time, but that was in a specific department and as you say in a specific context. I don’t think any larger lesson can be drawn about the ideological or theological nature of UCD from that. To be honest it doesn’t surprise me that philosophy departments in a nominally Catholic country at one time would have had a tilt towards RCC. It doesn’t make it right, far from it, but it’s hardly news.

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28. smiffy - October 21, 2008

Frankly, if Worldbystorm wants to keep his real name (which I happen to know is Rev. Josemaria Escriva McQuaid) secret, that’s entirely his own business.

Seriously, though, while one really shouldn’t engage with someone like Seamus Breathnach, as there are obvious certain personal issues being worked though, in relation to the question of the social sciences in UCD, if you look at some of those who are prominent in the university at present – Kathleen Lynch, Ger Moane, John Baker, Kieran Allen, Ailbhe Smyth – they’re not really the kind of people you might expect to find muttering to themselves when the bell goes ‘ding’ at 12 and 6. But Seamus’ argument doesn’t tend to rely on facts of evidence so much, so he’ll probably think this is an irrelevance.

However, on sonofstan’s point about the driving ideology behind the UCD philosophy department, it’s certainly the case that there was (and, to a lesser extent, still is) a strong RCC element, with the proportion of academics who are in religious orders being significantly higher than in most other departments. It would certainly be quite noticeable in terms of the department’s approach of moral philosophy, for example, but as WbS correctly points out, it is something primarily confined to that Department.

On a personal point, though, I recall Ger Casey’s lectures in philosophy when I was a student there in the early to mid nineties (during the period where Richard Kearney – hardly someone who bowed his knee to the Pope of Rome – was the head of the department). Casey lectured me on logic in first year, while in final year he taught analytical philosophy (late Wittgenstein, if I recall correctly; it’s quite a while ago now). Seamus is unlikely to be aware, but that’s pretty much as close to ‘secular philosophy’ as you’re likely to get. He also gave a course in Chinese philosophy, but I wasn’t very good at it and didn’t do very well in the exams. I never once heard him proselytise or make any comment with any bearing on his activities outside the day job.

He was completely nuts, though.

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29. sonofstan - October 21, 2008

He was completely nuts, though.

Still is…

Just caught the end of Prime Time’s look at University funding, and, frankly, Hugh Brady’s obsession with league tables, and marketing is a much bigger threat to the quality of education you’re liable to get there (and elsewhere in the sector) than the shadow of the Crozier.
Another area where the a ‘neo- liberal’ case (to quote Kieran Allen in the programme) is given a free run in the media, whereas arguments about inclusion and the quality of undergrad. teaching (and fair treatment of post-grad tutors and demonstrators) are given short shrift.

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30. Seamus Breathnach - October 22, 2008

How utterly Irish! I am one of the very , very few people who is actually prepared to use his ‘Christian’ name to voice his opinions — all others , for whatever reason, prefering to spit from behind a curtain on the common weal. And on matters relating to third level educaiton, as well! Smiffy even believes and believes ” Seriously…, while one really shouldn’t engage with someone like Seamus Breathnach, ,. bla, bla , bla, bla…’

The problem with Ireland is that there are so many good reasons why one should –and must — remain anonymous in a totalitarian society… The unfortunate consequences of such understanding,however, is that it is doomed to to remain in the clutches of liars, cheats, treacherous Romans and their endless legions of liege lackies everywhere, especially from UCD (and now Trinity) to the Law Library and the Civil Service. At least Michael MacDowell know this, for whenever anything had to be enquired into , the enquirers invariably came from UCD and/or the Law Libary. The practice mirrored exactly what the Jesuits (qua Sociologists) did over the last 50 years. There wasn’t one enqury but one of these ‘sociologists’ dominated its proceedings, the people who manned them , and came up with the most massively boring reports.

On the question of clerical pedophelia alone, there had been no less than two penal enquiries, both managed by Jesuit/’Sociologists’ and both having absolutely nothing to say about buggery in the Reformatory or Industrial Schools — even when, later, thanks to the persistence of English journalists and Bruce Arnold in particular, a report had been buried in the Archdiocese for years. We are led to believe that no Minister, including Mr Woods ,the generous Minister for Education, never knew anything about it. And what of Ken Whitaker, the civil servant who after fifteen years, read Keynes and actually convinced the Irish clergy that making wealth by way of a most pedestrial economic plan is not ‘materialism’ gone mad. The Irish Church, snug behind its granite walls, convinced the Irish world that it should remain in the same state of ignorant paralysis as it was in the middle ages…

Why would a serious mind bother himself with such people? Does it not, indeed, prove the unassailable proposition that the Irish mind , when it isn’t mediocre , is invariably medieval. Wasn’ t it for these reasons that our best minds, James Joyce and Dermot Morgan, were chased out of the country, while Dave Allen had the good sense just to leave.

Quite recently the periodical hatred for Cromwell flaired up in the press, the true remnants of catholic propaganda against the hated English whom the Papacy first invited to occupy Ireland. What no Irish person dares to ask is how they imagine Parliamentary Democracy was invented, if not through the strength and courage of Cromwell. Do Irish people imagine that the RC Church would ever allow democracy within their own ranks or worse, social mobility between the laity and the ones with the sacred fingers? What could anyone do with the Irish. Cromwell had to take out his king and chop his head off: the Irish could’nt produce a monarch,and when they had one in Parnell, the same rabble from Rome that sold them into slavery, destroyed Parnell. Why? Because he loved a woman, a real , live, mature, sensuous, baby-producing woman…. The celibates wouldn’t alow the Irish to have a King — and not for the first time; so, they reigned in their superstitious rabble against Parnell. It was Joyce who kept that struggle alive — otherwise it would go the way of all things Irish, into the endless pit of an unexamined past.

The point of the argument, I thought was the condition of Irish poltical life. So, I shall repeat what I have said elsewhere on the simple suppostion that whoever seriously wishes to discover these things may do so for themselves: The Irish Republic, apart from words on a piece of paper, has no ‘Separation of Powers’; it is owned and run thoroughly by the RCC, who know no ‘separation of power’ within its own ranks or within its Church/State grasp at the heart and throat of the Republic.

No matter what aspect of Irish life one enquires into, one finds the same dead end in the repetitive assertion of the superstitious values enshrined in Titus Vespasian Caesar’s Vicar’s New Testament. Apart from the appropriation of Irish wealth, Irish fertility and the management of the IRISH mind universally , this whole tissue of superstitions is an utter lie and has consequences detrimental to the nation’s well-being. Even now that scholarship has shown these things to be true, the Church/State ensemble is everywhere connived at by secret societies, religous and lay, and are perfectly patrolled through the universities, the Law Library and the Political Parties. It isn’t a question of Fianna Fail being a thoroughly Opus Dei driving party, but that all other parties have no greater ambition than to take their place. As a matter of interest, one might have hoped for serious politicoes to have asked the serious quesion: How did De Valera get on the inside track, when Cumann na nGaedheal had done such stalwart service for the Chruch in the first ten years of the Saorstat. No one has bothered to look at the Eurcharistic Congress, the 1937 Constitution , the sale of Irish children to the US in the 50s, the gradual ownership of the schools or the ratlining of the Nazies in this respect. What did De Valera promise the Holy Romans to get their party in power for such a long period. When we think of Michael Woods ,we know why they are kept in power, but how did they make the initial impression?

If there is no real Separation of Powers, merely a sop to good Protestant Government, how can they be a genuine judiciary, civil service or universities. A casual scan will see that all these institutions connive at advising the Bishops against being caught for buggaries or for financial transactions also, and that they perpetuate themselves on standards that have nothing whatsoever to do with academic know-how. One can labour in the charitable field (the Church/State has so many vineyards to work in) — one of those awful charities ad nauseum — rake in the money, leave the civil service, advise the Church how not to be caught, and step up to a High Court bench without the slightest qualms of conscience. One can move from one part of government to any other without as much as planting a ad in the paper…The little Republic loves the sound of big words like ‘The Separation of Powers’, but guided by its Roman Alter Ego it can ignore them totally.

The question hanging over the Irish is much more fundamental than where some lecherous Opus Dei or Jesuits types are hiding being every Minister’s wardrobe. The proclivity of the Irish is to produce squalor and put nice names on it, and that this , in my opinion, is its historical nature as informed and organised by the Church/State ensemble.

Seamus Breathnach

http://www.irish-criminology.com

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31. smiffy - October 22, 2008

“bla bla bla”, indeed.

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32. WorldbyStorm - October 22, 2008

Perfect.

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33. Seamus Breathnach - October 30, 2008

The Irish woiuldn’t know ‘secular’ if it bit them in the arse!

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