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ASTI dispute November 8, 2016

Posted by WorldbyStorm in Uncategorized.
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Any thoughts, observations?

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1. 6to5against - November 8, 2016

Tangential to the dispute itself, but on public sector pay last night, Clair Byrne ran a segment where the panel consisted of Leo Varadaka, who has imposed pay cuts, Willie O’Dea, who has imposed pay cuts and Dan O’Brien who has campaigned through his journalism for paycuts.

I thought initially that there wasn’t even a pretence of balance but then I realised they had one FGer and one FFer, along with an ‘impartial’ economist. That was their pretence at balance.

And then when their carefully selected survey group came in with an opinion of pay cuts, she turned to Leo and asked him why the public didn’t understand what they were being told.

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Gewerkschaftler - November 8, 2016

So the unacknowledged Irish Pravda is still alive and well.

RTE – an excuse for a (advertising dependent) so-called public broadcaster.

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2. Gewerkschaftler - November 8, 2016

Well done and solidarity with the ASTI.

Teachers are more important to the general well-being than, say, auctioneers. They should be well paid for what they do.

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3. irishelectionliterature - November 8, 2016

I do think ASTI could do a better job explaining as people are confused by the two different sets of Industrial Action.
The strike has also led to conflict in households … my son had school yesterday and my daughter was off🙂

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6to5against - November 8, 2016

They really could.

its a source of endless frustration to hear your reps over-explaining, getting bogged down in technical detail and utterly failing to get a simple message across while facing public representatives that have been drilled in keeping it simple and always getting a message across – even if its simplistic and/or misleading.

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4. crocodileshoes - November 8, 2016

3 different disputes, really. The ASTI’s fully justified opposition to Junior Cycle ‘reform’ is being forgotten because no schools are closed because of it, but in the long term it’s just as important a fight as the other 2.

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5. Joe - November 8, 2016

Waved and gave a solidarity greeting to two young female ASTI picketers in the rain this morning. Very impressed with their commitment to the picket – it seems clear that this strike is supported by the membership.
How to win is the question. They have been left out on a limb by the ‘mainstream’ trade union movement. Government can hold a hard line against ASTI in the hope that if they break them, they can then hold a hard line re Lansdowne Rd against the rest of the unions.
Is there an opening in doing some kind of agreement that gets whatever TUI and INTO have already got? Go back to work. Then come back for more on the tails of the ‘mainstream’ union movement who are saying the LRA is finished and pay restoration has to be fast tracked. So ASTI then let them do the heavy lifting for a change rather than the other way around?
ASTI could claim that they’ve won already cos they (and the cops, maybe moreso) have forced the ‘mainstream’ union movement to say the LRA is finished. So any fast tracking of pay restoration would apply to ASTI now too.

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6to5against - November 8, 2016

Quite honestly I think a deal could easily be done along these lines: govt agree to the principle of equal pay to be included in the new national agree about which talks begin after Xmas. Croke pk hours are infuriating but not a block to a deal. JC reform to be discussed at a new forum including all stakeholders (asti have already pretty much won on all the key points there. All that’s left is a lack of trust and detail.)

Remember there’s no dispute about s+s which is closing schools. Govt just have to honour a deal already agreed.

But the govt don’t want to do a deal. Remember there really are some radicals involved here. One or two on the union side and a small but powerful cohort in the senior civil service who want to humiliate the asti and assert control over all unions.

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irishelectionliterature - November 8, 2016

Stupid Question I know …… but have the Labour Party (post government) made any statements about the current dispute?

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1798Mike - November 8, 2016

The architects of FEMPI ! You must be joking. The so-called ‘Labour’ Party has condemned itself to utter irrelevance. Just like ICTU – dominated by SIPTU, IMPACT and their little bag carrier, the INTO – it has become the dog that never barks or bites.

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6to5against - November 8, 2016

Well Howlin has been talking about accelerated talks to a new national agreement. But does it matter?

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RosencrantzisDead - November 8, 2016

There was a labour councillor (John Walsh) on the News at One today. I missed the opening of the interview so I had to listen to the end to get his identity – he was described as an education advisor to Ruari Quinn. I googled the name afterwards and it revealed he was a councillor in Fingal.

He was dismissive of the ASTI. He stated that the government should not negotiate with the union until they declared that they were willing to compromise. I am not sure what is meant by this. He went on to criticise the fact that they were striking on multiple issues and said they needed to make up their mind.

The usual stuff about the financial straits the country is in and how restoration of pay is not possible. Teachers seeking more pay were cast as being in opposition to those who require disability services: satisfying one means screwing over the other.

There was some discussion of the ballot for industrial action and he speculated the members did not understand the issues or what striking entails.

Have Labour given up on the Trade Union vote? Who do they think is going to vote for the Labour party now?

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6to5against - November 8, 2016

He was a education correspondent for many years before leaving to be Quinn’s adviser. Didn’t know he was a councillor.

He was awful. Dismissed the entire campaign on the basis that full pay equality wouldn’t be possible immediately, and that the union was ridiculous to demand that. The union hasn’t put a timeline on its demands, and has made no mention of ‘immediate’ restoration so his point was meaningless, but of course was let stand.

And I heard the point about members not understanding what they were voting for. This has been a constant theme of the gov’t campaign – and it has been taken up by some in the union, but there was a detailed information leaflet put out before all recent votes.

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RosencrantzisDead - November 8, 2016

I could have mixed him up with another person. Quite possibly.

Still risibke stuff and worse when you think this was Ruari Quinn’s SpAd.

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CMK - November 8, 2016

One of the undercurrents of this dispute is that bureaucracy of the unions are, to a man and woman, in the government’s camp and against ASTI. Ferociously so, in some cases But, and it is a huge ‘but’ with important ramifications, the rank and file in the unions, including rank and file members of executives, are largely supportive of ASTI. What is being tested is the model beloved of officials which sees regular, stable, agreements following on, one to the other, in perpetuity, with few or no strikes and ‘servicing’ as the main job of unions, coupled with flogging pensions and insurance cover. These agreements are wholly unsuited to post austerity public sector industrial relations, there was too much lost under them and they are now utterly discredited. I expect LRA to be scrapped early next year with a new deal negotiated and then rejected due to whatever ‘productivity’ measures the government manage to demand. Then, who knows? Can the bureaucrats and the government credibly invoke FEMPI against several unions? They might try to press gang Brexit as a reason for FEMPI. Interesting times ahead.

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6. RosencrantzisDead - November 8, 2016

News is the industrial action has been suspended. Any updayes on what caused this?

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6to5against - November 8, 2016

Talks at the wrc.

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6to5against - November 8, 2016

I think cmk has the context of this spot on above.
Hopefully talks at the wrc will blend into talks on a full agreement with the other teaching unions at least.
If all we have achieved is that, as part of those talks, new entrants are brought onto equal pay scales with Pre 2008 workers, I’d be proud enough.

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