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Black Sabbath and Joy Division January 21, 2017

Posted by WorldbyStorm in Uncategorized.
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Two of my favourite groups, perhaps top ten in both cases – albeit a fluid top ten/twenty – actually there’s a task for another day, trying to determine top 20s. I had a friend in school who in the late 70s and early 80s had a copy book filled with his then top twenty songs and groups. I admired his persistence. Even more impressive was how it changed from week to week, with groups rising or falling, some away for ever.

But they two groups always struck me as having an oddly similar sound in places. The first time I heard Interzone from Unknown Pleasures I thought… hmmm, something about the swing of the guitar line that cuts in after the drums was oddly reminiscent, but there were even more on the nose similarities. And then I heard New Dawn Fades…

Okay, let’s be clear, overall the sound of the two groups is not exactly the same, but those similarities are compelling, throbbing bass lines, oddly familiar riffs. And I’m not the only one to have these thoughts it appears.

And interestingly…

“PETER HOOK (the bassist) told me they were basically trying to make a primitive version of BLACK SABBATH and LED ZEPPELIN, whereas today’s brands just want to sound exactly like Joy Division without understanding the heaviness of them.” – Billy Corgan

Or how about this?

And here’s Simon Reynolds writing about Joy Division noting that Digital ‘sounds not a million miles from Sabbath’s ‘Paranoid’… and proceeds to delineate the similarities between the two groups approach.

Joy Division New Dawn Fades

Sabbath, War Pigs (6.32 in)

Oddly Sabbath kind of copied themselves and War Pigs later on this during the Dio era… at least in the initial riff here.

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Comments»

1. donesoverydone - January 21, 2017

Reblogged this on things I've read or intend to.

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2. sonofstan - January 22, 2017

Tangent to that, but i heard ‘love will tear us apart’ on BBC local radio here early yesterday morning: clearly, to the playlist controllers on three counties radio, it’s no heavier than the police or something. Part of rock’s rich tapestry. Whereas i don’t think they’d play Sabbath. Odd to hear a song that seemed to come from another world once now blend seamlessly into a breakfast show

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WorldbyStorm - January 22, 2017

Funny you should say that because I was thinking about Reynolds who by the by I like and his use of the word ‘lumpen’ in the link above in relation to Sabbath. I know he is not writing from a middle class English perspective but that word rankles, because BS were working class English (one from Irish catholic, one from Italian catholic backgrounds) as much as JD and while they were at times cartoonish and silly hardly more so than the Cramps or whoever…

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3. sonofstan - January 22, 2017

And funny etc… Was thinking about reynolds today cos i’d read his obit for Mark Fisher, which kinda missed one of the things that was distnctive about MF, which was his class awareness; and i was in Oxford today, where Reynolds went to uni, and it must be so easy to lose sight of, or never see, what the rest of the world is like in those gilded environs. Blows my mind in Oxford when you see all the colleges and the dreaming spires etc that manage to dominate large parts of a quite sizeable city, and realise it has fewer students than UCD.

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WorldbyStorm - January 22, 2017

What, I never knew that re oxford? That’s incredible.

Class in the UK…sigh. I’m beginning to think the 80s and 90s were a break from standard operating procedure when one sees how heavily middle class media etc are now.

Have you read Reynolds glam book, pretty good I thought even if the definition of glam is pretty wide.

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sonofstan - January 22, 2017

More, just looked at oxford cc website to check population and ‘attainment in state schools is below national average’ and ‘one in four children live in poverty’ and, yet, it has 1.08 jobs for every inhabitant.

No haven’t gotten around to Glam yet. On the list…

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WorldbyStorm - January 22, 2017

Well that’s a pretty crushing indictment of Oxford.

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6to5against - January 22, 2017

I presume it was just that: a break from the norm that was quickly ‘fixed’, mainly by using fees and interviews to restrict access to art school and media work to the ‘right’ sort.

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sonofstan - January 22, 2017

Yep. Although the break probably lasted from the early 50s to the late 80s.

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WorldbyStorm - January 22, 2017

Yes, I’d think on reflection that timeline is about right.

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4. bacopa - February 6, 2017

I’ve always thought JD’s “Disorder” and Sabbath’s “Paranoid” were pretty much the same song.

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WorldbyStorm - February 6, 2017

Yes, lyrically and in terms of the upfront bass etc…

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