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Polling on Brexit in the UK June 10, 2018

Posted by WorldbyStorm in Uncategorized.
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No great surprise from the latest Observer Opinium poll that:

However, the public remain unmoved on whether or not to have a new referendum. Asked if there should be another in-out referendum on the final deal, 38% said there should be, while 48% said there should not be.

Completely understandable. I know opinions differ, but for me at least a rerun would be the wrong approach and the original poll has a democratic legitimacy.

As to the shape of Brexit,

 

The poll shows the public is shifting towards wanting to stay in the EU’s single market. Currently 38% would prefer to stay in the single market even if it means allowing free movement of Labour, while 34% would prefer to end free movement of labour even if it means we leave the single market.

Which suggests some solid good sense is beginning to manifest itself.

Depressingly the BLP is slightly behind the Tories, a trend evident for some time now. And heres’s an interesting stat:

 

With Brexiters in the cabinet also fearing that the issue is being mishandled by Downing Street, the poll showed that only 41% of leave voters trust the Tories most to lead the negotiations – the lowest level since January 2017.

Comments»

1. peaceandneutrality - June 11, 2018

The war loving mainstream political parties forced the Irish people to vote again on the Lisbon Treaty and spent €millions for a yes vote and Martin abolished the National Forum on Europe that provided space for democratic debate on the Lisbon 1 referendum. Now, as a consequence of Lisbon via PESCO the Irish Defence Forces are being integrated into the Army of the EU which will do exactly the same as the Army of the British Union, invade, conquer and occupy other people’s countries. Only the most reactionary, democracy hating elements in the UK want another referendum.

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GW - June 11, 2018

I think we’ve already covered the fact that PESCO is opt-in rather than compulsory and that RoI hasn’t opted in to much.

Enough already.

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2. Joe - June 11, 2018

“Only the most reactionary, democracy hating elements in the UK want another referendum.”

Wow. Is an electorate not entitled to change its mind?

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3. GW - June 11, 2018

Of course the first poll has a democratic legitimacy over a vague promise made on the basis of lies using distinctly anti-democratic methods.

Now this bubble has been burst, a multi-option poll on various forms of Brexit including the ‘as you were’ option (assuming that is still available) would exercise democratic legitimacy over a concrete decision where many of the facts are now known.

It’s democratic legitimacy would, I would argue, trump that of the first.

As Joe says, the electorate is as entitled to change its mind when the facts changed as anyone/anything else.

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4. peaceandneutrality - June 11, 2018

Joe, yes of course, after a decent interval such as the second divorce referendum, or the recent Repeal referendum. In the case of the Lisbon Treaty there was no such gap.

GW, there was virtually no debate on PESCO when we joined, and while it is true our commitment to the emerging EU Army is very small compared to the 200,000 German led EU Army, once Irish participation in EU Army has started, it will only grow bigger. A hundred years ago the imperial culture of the British Union was rejected and is now being reborn via the European Union and its army. Anybody with a shred of knowledge of the French and German military that will dominate the EU Army should know that this EU Army project is just a restructuring of imperialism. Since everybody on this thread are sharp enough to know that, then if they support PESCO they are imperialists.

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WorldbyStorm - June 11, 2018

PAN, I’m not sure I see the connection between your first three or four sentences in the original comment you posted and your last. Moreover given there are members of the BLP on the left (not Blairites) who support a rerun, even in my view where a rerun isn’t democratically legitimate at this point is simply my view, clearly it’s nowhere near clear cut and certainly not to the point that we can dismiss all those calling for one as ‘reactionary’ or ‘democracy hating’.

As to PESCO, I think there’s a lot of space between not being overly concerned about PESCO and supporting PESCO (and I think there’s a fair bit of space even amongst those who might support it and those who are actual imperialists and that’s quite a loaded term to bandy about IMO). In other words no one here ‘supports’ PESCO but not all of us are as exercised by its existence as you – entirely as is your right – are.

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