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That co-op bank idea January 22, 2011

Posted by Tomboktu in A co-op bank.
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At the end of November, I mulled here the idea of getting a co-op bank established in Ireland. Sonofstan had suggested that the ICTU would be a useful organisation to act as the catalyst. This week, I will try to get a motion on the topic on the agenda of my own union’s branch AGM. Others are welcome to copy and adapt for their union.

Establishment of a co-operative bank in Ireland

“(1) This ADC notes the following developments in the not-for-profit financial services sector in Ireland
(a) that the EBS is about to be sold to a private company,
(b) that the INBS is also likely to cease trading as a mutual, and
(c) that some years ago the TSB was “sold” by the government to a for-private-profit company.

(2) This ADC notes that in light of those developments, the only options available individuals in Ireland for large financial tasks such as mortgages or many necessary services like a current account or an ATM account is now to bank with a for-private-profit company.

(3) This ADC notes that credit unions may still continue to exist but that
(a) credit unions are restricted in the range of services they can provide, and
(b) under the recently enacted Credit Institutions (Stabilisation) Act 2010, the position of credit unions as membership-driven could be ended under the powers given to Minister for Finance to transfer the business of a credit union, which do not require that any such transfer must be to another not-for-profit.

(4) This ADC believes
(a) that there is a need for an alternative to be created to enable people in Ireland to have a real choice in ordinary retail financial services like credit cards, ATMs, mortgages, cheque books, motor loans, etc., and
(b) that such an alternative could usefully take the form of a co-operative bank similar to ones available to people in other EU countries, and
(c) that the trade union movement has a large enough membership and has the structures and resources to explore the feasibility and to act as the catalyst for setting up a co-operative bank in Ireland.

(5) Therefore, this ADC instructs
(a) the incoming Executive Committee to request the ICTU to investigate the possibility or options for the establishment of a co-operative bank that would provide retail banking services, such as mortgages, current accounts, ATM accounts, and the full range of other retail financial services for individuals (to members generally in addition to, public servants and trade
union members), and
(b) the incoming Executive Committee to campaign vigorously within ICTU on this matter and to report to ADC 2011 on progress achieved or on any related issues of consequence.”

Comments»

1. WorldbyStorm - January 22, 2011

That’s fantastic Tomboktu… and something we could all be pushing for in our own unions…

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2. RepublicanSocialist1798 - January 22, 2011

Interesting concept.

Though I wouldnt put it past AIB or Anglo Irish to attempt to take ICTU to court under the competition Act for having an “unfair advantage” in being able to get members of it’s union to join.

By the way would membership be restricted to people who are members of Unions or could Joe Bloggs off the street walk in and ask to create an account?

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Tomboktu - January 22, 2011

I would see it as being for members of the public generally.

Will need to tweak the following:

and the full range of other retail financial services for individuals (to members of the public generally in addition to, public servants and trade union members)

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3. fergal - January 22, 2011

Brilliant idea.What about getting help from financial cooperatives abroad?Like the Credit Cooperatif in France or the Cooperative bank in UK?
My union` motions have already been sent in but I`ll try to get discussed at least.

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sonofstan - January 22, 2011

Rabobank is another one.

Great work, Tomboktu – feel inadequate when I see where you’ve gone with my half an idea.

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4. Pope Epopt - January 23, 2011

Interesting idea – and the credit unions might be persuaded to bank there. If recently discovered mine has some money sunk in Anglo Irish. I kid you not.

I think I’m right in saying that there are fairly onerous capital and insurance requirements when starting a retail bank, but they should be within the resources of the ICTU. There’s going to be no shortage of retail bank premises in every small town in the country.

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5. Cian - January 23, 2011

Out of interest, why are you aiming to start something from scratch, rather than as part of the Credit Union movement?

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Tomboktu - January 23, 2011

Cian,

The answer to that two parts. First, as I understand it (and possibly incorrectly) current credit unions are restricted. Certainly, they operate in restricted domains — for example, members must live in a certain area or be employed in a certain profession. I believe that they are restricted in the services they can provide. I want a “main street” bank open to all, providing everything that a retail bank provides.

That said, credit unions could turn out to form the basis for a new bank. One of the commenters in one of the two earlier threads where this was discusses pointed out that in some other country (I can’t remember which one), the co-op bank is owned by credit unions.

Second, in light of that, and aprticularly realing how little I know and could learn to be comfortable with, I wouldn’t say that I am necessarily looking to start a new bank from scratch. I am asking that the idea of a new bank be examined from scratch.

The one thing I want with a new bank, unlike, say the car company’s one now being advertised, is that it is not-for-private profit.

When I started to try to draft a motion on this, I found that I don’t have the legal or financial expertise to propose the answer. The feasibility study might say that deeper linking of credit unions might be the way forward. Or it could find that a change in the law is needed to enable the credit unions to merge to form a co-op bank. Or it might say that the best way would be to bring in an existing co-op bank in another EU country as a retail outlet (say, moving Rabobank from an internet provider to one with a shop my mother could use).

In my early 20s I opened a bank account with the then Dublin TSB, and saw that (following a merger with other TSBs) sold by the Government to the Irish Permanent. And then I took out a mortgage with EBS, only to see it about to be sold. (And a strong runner for that is a private equity firm — even worse than a PLC where the details on financial accounts and on accountability for decisions is, in theory, open to scrutiny.)

[I am told that I a bit unusual about my consumer choices: when I eventually got around to buying a mobile phone, I checked with the CWU as to which service providers in Ireland recognise trade unions for representing staff in individual disputes and collective bargaining for pay, conditions of work, etc. (Vodafone and Meteor at the time, if you are interested.) I couldn’t find anything about the choice of hardware. There doesn’t seem to be any information about the ethics (employment or materials purchasing were the two things I could think if) to help one choose between Nokia, Siemens, Motorolla, SonyEricsson, etc.,]

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6. Alan Rouge - February 8, 2011

There is a public lecture in UCD on a Spanish co-op bank. It’s on tonight at half 7 in Newman Building Room C108.

See link: https://docs.google.com/viewer?a=v&pid=explorer&chrome=true&srcid=1KpOE9tLs9hDA9ZMsFxlFblL6IF3IpnYeJGjBpDYE9MG4KJ0Q36t-0RjvtcjU&hl=en

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7. Tomboktu - April 17, 2011
WorldbyStorm - April 17, 2011

That would be a real step forward, though it would require serious finessing not to lose the original intent.

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Jim Monaghan - April 22, 2011

The problem there is that many of them got caught up in the frenzy and I would guess that the gombeen class went in to them as well. A number of them stayed out of the federation and I would guess it was for good reasons.
The building societies were really coops. But again there many were taken over by gombeen types.

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8. CL - April 17, 2011

Amalgamated Bank in NYC was established in 1923 by the Amalgamated Clothing Workers Union. It is still union owned.
http://www.amalgamatedbank.com/home/aboutus/locations

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9. Was that ‘Yes’, ‘No’, or ‘No, but I want you to think it’s “Yes”‘ « The Cedar Lounge Revolution - April 22, 2011

[…] patience being a backbench TD. On Wednesday, Robert Dowds asked a parliamentary question on a pet topic of mine, co-op banks and mutually owned financial institutions.   72. Deputy Robert Dowds asked […]

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